Comments on: Rape survey at Air Force Academy shows big problem - which it probably underestimates

By: ginmar

ginmar — Fri, 25 Mar 2005 16:24:07 +0000

Tsu Doh Nym, MSgt, USAF, I’m in the Army myself, and I have to say that until the military starts discussing EO issues and using the word sexism to do so, nothing will change. booze is a crutch.

By: piny

piny — Thu, 24 Mar 2005 19:51:09 +0000

Women who aren’t officers complain of the same treatment at the hands of male soldiers who aren’t officers. Alcohol cannot be blamed for the epidemic of sexual assault and harassment in the armed forces, any more than in society at large–in many of the reported incidents, cold-blooded humiliation was clearly a motive.

And as far as bringing back “discipline,” well. The root causes of this problem are not new; women in the armed forces are. Discipline is worthless without a crackdown on misogyny _as misogyny_. It is possible to be extremely disciplined–and to behave honorably towards those you believe to be your fellow soldiers–while at the same time being a misogynist who believes that no woman can really be a fellow soldier. See the operant dynamic? Women _suffer_ from these kinds of ideals–they are most frequently seen as interlopers who must be stopped.

Your solution posits that this is a problem of immaturity, a general, ungendered disrespect. That’s incorrect. Rape is a form violence practiced mostly against women, and rooted in a deep hatred for women. Sobriety and training won’t solve it.

By: Tsu Doh Nym, MSgt, USAF

Tsu Doh Nym, MSgt, USAF — Thu, 24 Mar 2005 19:21:50 +0000

Simple solution:
Ban booze at the Academy, period full stop.
Bring back real discipline (not hazing, discipline) and enforce the honor code.
Require all prospective officers to serve as enlisted troops for at least two years before attending the Academy. I’d certainly appreciate serving under the more clueful officers this would produce. The average 2Lt is almost useless for its first couple of years anyway, and starting out as an AB would give it a chance to grow under adult supervision before it is empowered to do damage.

By: ginmar

ginmar — Wed, 23 Mar 2005 14:25:47 +0000

That’s the thing. That was a parody of sexist stereotypes of women, and how conveniant that they just stepped up and confirmed all those sexist myths! Just a coincidence, I’m sure. Nope, if all those stereotypes are true, then fears about rape in the academy are groundless, too.

No, there’s no agenda there at all.

By: piny

piny — Tue, 22 Mar 2005 17:25:47 +0000

…It’s interesting because it makes you wonder what actual woman this poster knows, and how, and what contact s/he has had with them. Whether or not this person is actually in the Air Force, I worry about them. S/he’s almost certainly lying about being two people and about being in the Air Force–and I suspect s/he’s lying about being female. And s/he’s telling these almost-certainly lies in order to promulgate misconceptions about rape in general and about an epidemic of rape in particular. Doesn’t sound like a safe person to know.

By: ginmar

ginmar — Tue, 22 Mar 2005 16:18:43 +0000

Well, it might matter because it’s interesting that they’d step up and lie about something like this.

By: jam

jam — Tue, 22 Mar 2005 15:04:17 +0000

y’know, i don’t see how it matters whether Sandy J & Wendy Sue are for real or not. a few anecdotes does not a structural analysis make (hell, it doesn’t even make a deeply flawed attempt at structural analysis, like the DoD study).

By: ginmar

ginmar — Tue, 22 Mar 2005 14:46:53 +0000

Hell, I’m IN the army myself, and—-Jesus, there are repercussions for real accusations, if the guy is popular and what not.

By: piny

piny — Tue, 22 Mar 2005 13:59:40 +0000

Nope. My favorite part was how there were no repercussions for the false accusation. Riiiiight.

By: mythago

mythago — Tue, 22 Mar 2005 04:53:18 +0000

You don’t need to be a lawyer for the bullshit detector to pop a wire on the “Air Force” girls, there.

By: piny

piny — Mon, 21 Mar 2005 16:25:09 +0000

Hee. I love that Amptoons has legal counsel.

By: mythago

mythago — Mon, 21 Mar 2005 15:33:37 +0000

And they don’t seem to have a very good idea of how the AF JAG works, either.

By: ginmar

ginmar — Mon, 21 Mar 2005 14:20:28 +0000

So a friend of yours gets hurt—supposedly—and you seek to defame all rape victims? Yeah, I’d guess that wasn’t taking this seriously. And you’re sure it’s a false accusation? After all, a person who’s lied already is eminently trustworthy.

By: Sandy J

Sandy J — Sun, 20 Mar 2005 23:05:52 +0000

I knew I shouldn’t have said anything. We just think that it’s unfair. I didn’t proof my email. Sorry for the typos and grammatical errors. I guess I didn’t take this seriously enough. I just did it because I agreed with Wendy and she was upset with one of our friends being hurt by a false accusation. Please take my comment off this site. I don’t want any trouble or hate.

By: ginmar

ginmar — Sun, 20 Mar 2005 14:03:18 +0000

The big question is if they’re male or female. So nice to see people’s fantasies first thing in the morning.

By: Robert

Robert — Sat, 19 Mar 2005 21:24:29 +0000

Such cynicism ill becomes you, Amp. Surely Sandy and Wendy are roommates at the Air Force Academy, sharing a PC. All cadets refer to their school as the “airforce academy”, think that “perspective” is spelled “prospective”, and that the past tense of “let” is “lets”.

By: Ampersand

Ampersand — Sat, 19 Mar 2005 21:12:27 +0000

By an amazing coincidence, Sandy J and Wendy Sue both posted from the same IP address. Usually that means it’s one poster pretending to be two different people.

By: Sandy J

Sandy J — Sat, 19 Mar 2005 20:50:50 +0000

In the Airforce, we’re not suppose to have sex with the guys, but it happens. I was busted and claimed rape because I was scared. The guy said she won’t report it if I actually consented, but if I claimed rape, the guy will be prosecuted and he’ll stay in prison for 10 years and have to register as a sex offender for the rest of his life. It sort of put things in prospective. Making him my scapegoat for something I consented to do is wrong. I know nothing would be done to me even if I was caught with this false accusation, but I still felt “funny” sending him to jail. All I wanted to do was have sex! That’s all. The Air force shouldn’t be able to enforce my civil liberties. I came clean and the officer lets us go. We didn’t even get in trouble for having sex. I wonder how many other women are having sex and using the unsuspecting guy as a scapegoat?

By: Wendy Sue

Wendy Sue — Sat, 19 Mar 2005 20:41:59 +0000

I’ve been in the airforce academy for three years, and I’ve know many lose girlfriends who like to hve sex with lots of guys, and a few actually tossed the idea around if they are busted, they’ll just claim rape. I know a girl who was on a warning for drug use, and in order to avoid another drug test, she seduced a guy and went awol (with the idea to give time for the drugs to get out of her system), when found she told she ran away because of rape. The poor guy was thrown in jail for several months before she admitted that she made up the whole story to avoid being thrown out. btw, she was not able to stay off of drugs while she was on AWOL. THe poor guy faced decades in prison and lost over 40 pounds, and all what happened to her was being discharged.

By: John Isbell

John Isbell — Thu, 01 Jan 1970 00:00:00 +0000

Thank you for opening my eyes about rape surveys. Of course, 11 times here would make over 100% of female cadets victims, so the numbers must vary. I’d just assumed that a lot of people would say no out of privacy.
One quibble: “any time groups of young men are brought together and taught to be “masculine” (whether it’s in the army, a frat house, or a football team), chances are that some of the men will rape.” I know what you mean, but I played high-level sport for ten years, with various teams, and I’m pretty sure none of us ever raped anybody, nowhere around the other players anyway. Yes there was sex and a fair bit of pot. I guess I should note the sport was Ultimate Frisbee.