It’s overpopulation. We have endangered all future generations because of how much our population has grown, and how much we consume. I have ceased to see new-born babies as adorable little bundles of joy, but instead as one more step toward environmental instability.

I am reminded of that island where some ship left a few deer for whatever reason. The vegatation was plentiful, so the deer ate, and multiplied. In time the deer population became too large for the vegatation to renew itself fast enough to feed the herd, and all the deer starved.

Previous generations had the luxury of not acknowledging the resource problems associated with overpopulation. Today we are not so lucky. If we do not begin to think about how shortages will affect future generations, does that mean we are no better at long-term planning than a herd of deer?

I realize this is a thread about breastfeeding, but again, every time I see a newborn nursing I think, “What a little deer!” I’m not endeering myself to the doe-eyed mothers here, am I?

Eating in public places has been permitted everywhere in the United States for quite some time (likely since before the American Revolution). Eating in public is not only permitted, it is common place, and has been, as I pointed out, for at least a century. (I suspect it has always been.)

It is ridiculous to suggest that this behavior was taboo!

Now, I might concede there were some people of certain generations in some parts of the country who thought eating in public was gauche. Gauche is not the same as taboo.

And I have to say that I would hardly be sympathetic to your hypothetical grandmother if she insisted that mothers and infants were required to bend themselves into pretzels to save her from witnessing something she considered gauche. Most books of etiquette would decree that when others are in greate need, your grandmother is required to avert her gaze and not complain.

It was not that long ago that it was considered animalistic behavior to be seen eating in the street; that the taboo has fallen out of fashion doesn’t mean it doesn’t still hold some sway in the minds of the older generation.

I’m a bit puzzled by the claim of a general public taboo against public eating anytime within the last 100 years.

Zillions of hotdogs were sold, carried around and eaten at the Columbia Exposition in 1893. Ice cream cones have been eaten in public since the turn of the last century. Both products had great commercial success when introduced and continue to be consumed in public. I could name additional instances of public eating, but I think most people realize eating in public was not “taboo”!

If public eating in general makes your grandmother uncomfortable, she really might need to get used to the fact that she is rather unusual even for her generation. People would find her request both ridiculous and rude if she asked discretely them to throw blankets over their heads while eating hot dogs. Why should breast feeding mothers react differently?

This is, of course, not to justify the attitude, but rather to explain it. Simply because it has an understandable cause doesn’t make it right. (Then again, in the intrests of full disclosure, I have to admit that ideologically I’m fully on the side of “anytime, anywhere” breastfeeding, but I do get squeamish about it, as I do about lots of other body-related things, up to and including glimpsing someone putting in their contact lenses, so I have, shall we say, a rather heightened awareness of the issue.)

I have also absorbed some of the idea that eating on the street is not the proper thing to do, which is I suspect also tied up in class issues.

Lest anyone get the idea that I’m trying to make this question simple, I’m not. I think it’s multivalent, but I’m surprised nobody’s yet explicitly brought up the idea that, despite all the objectification and glorification, this culture still basically considers all bodies to be vaguely repulsive in certain ways.

Therefore there isn’t really a disconnect for the dissaproving where the breast if best argument is concerned because most of them think breastfeeding is both indecent and unnecessary. Thankfully I’ve never had a stranger direct negative comments my way the few times I’ve bfed in public, but then again I felt like I had to cover up as much as possible so that I didn’t get hassled for it. Of course if my father in law ever saw me breastfeed in public I think his head would explode.

Thanks for your words. You really hit the nail on the head there. I hadn’t thought about it in this context (duh), but I’ve always been very self-conscious about being large-breasted. It always equalled negative attention, so “they” and “I” had a pretty adversarial relationship. It wasn’t until long into my marriage that I could even learn to claim them as part of my body in bed. Now I have to learn to relate to them all over again, in public! But I do feel very encouraged and plan to give breastfeeding a very determined try.

I completely understand your anxiety. It was very hard for me to commit myself to breastfeeding exclusively and extendedly prior to giving birth. My issues were more about having grown up being large chested and having always been made to feel objectified as ‘the large breasted girl’, be it via nicknames, teasing from girls in the locker-room about wearing a bra when others weren’t, much less wearing something other than a training bra, and then also from boys trying to cop a feel, leer salaciously or ask inappropriate questions about them. Suffice it to say it took me until my twenties to get beyond my own breast issues, and I was reluctant to give up what peace I’d made when faced with the idea of having to breastfeed. I committed myself to trying to nurse for at least three months to get some benefit to the baby, but I felt for sure that I’d quit by the time that milestone was around. What I wasn’t expecting was the sheer level of pride and fulfillment I felt in finally understanding and being able to use my breasts for the exact purpose they were meant for, to the most enthusiastic and appreciative audience in the world. This new understanding committed me to trying to be as open and talkative about it as possible, as well as supporting women that need support with any and all things related to breastfeeding. It’s extremely important to the baby, but it’s also very valuable to the women who do breastfeed in claiming their bodies back from a society intent on taking them from us through invasive and often times sexualized expectations and objectification.

Trust me when I tell you this; though it might take a few weeks getting used to it and working through all the rough spots, nursing is very much worth it, and when you get to the point that you’re doing it, you won’t be worrying about anything other than you and your child.

Jeez, I wonder how old Fred Meyer would have felt about his employees harassing his customers. Of course, now that Kroger has bought out Freddy’s, I expect he’s spinning in his grave over a lot of the changes they’ve made.

Baby. Crying. If you have to put something in its mouth to quiet it, a nipple seems like the best possible thing, no?

I have always been pro-breastfeeding and always planned to do so myself. Yet, oddly, I’ve always felt a little weird when I come across someone breastfeeding, even under a blanket (’cuz ya still know what’s going on under there!). When one of my sisters-in-law whips out a breast and baby goes to town, it strikes me as bizarre that I feel a little creeped out. Maybe simply because my own breasts have always only been part of my sex life, and it’s hard not to identify that way.

I think there might be something else besides the sexual going on here, though. Maybe just something about personal boundaries, which can vary widely. I’d rather watch a million moms nursing their infants than be stuck on the bus near someone clipping their nails in public. Good lord, people, save your grooming and shedding for when you get home!!!! Living in San Francisco, where many people feel free to hock up stuff on the sidewalk right in front of you, was tough for me that way. And when I test my blood sugar, I do it someplace where a co-worker can’t see me. It does weird some people out if they come across you while you’re sticking pins in yourself or dropping some blood into the test strip.

That said, I don’t think people react negatively to breastfeeding in public because they think it looks like the baby is eating at work. I think it’s because of the old-fashioned belief that good girls don’t bare their private parts in public. Which is so stupid. And I totally agree that the daycare separation policy is stupid, too. I used to nurse my son when I picked him up from daycare before we got into the car, until one of the other mothers complained that I was doing it in front of her kid and maybe also her husband if he happened to arrive while I was doing it. So my daycare provider had to move the nursing rocker into another room and I had to close the door. Yargh.

But with that said, I’ve never heard of eating on the street being regarded as animalistic, and I regularly talk to elders. I mean, outdoor cafes and streetside food carts have been around a helluva lot longer than the industrial age.

Well, I don’t think I should have to look at black people in public. We should ask them to cover up with blankets.

/ snark

Anyway, to show you how ridiculous the breastfeeding craziness gets, I work at a daycare in which a mother has complained about other mothers breastfeeding in the infant room. As a result, there’s a separate “nursing room” where mothers can sit with their babies and be alone instead of in the classroom, where they could talk to the teachers and learn about their child’s day. Doesn’t that sound like a great idea?

Most women choose to nurse in their infant’s classroom, but I just find it ridiculous that a separate room is needed, especially at a daycare.

The irony involved in telling breastfeeding mothers to be discreet or do it privately is completely unbelieveable. We have this cultural message that says, “breast is best” it’s the catch phrase - but no one actually means that. So, breast is best for at least the first 6 months, better the whole year and then well, support sort of dwindles after babies reach a year despite all the evidence we have that says that nursing has numerous benefits way past the first year of life. Anyway, breast is best, but don’t do it in public. Which essentially means to anyone with a 6 month old or younger - you never get to leave the house for more than 45 minutes at a time. Breastfeeding is HARD WORK - I never knew how hard until I did it myself - I nursed for 24 weeks and reluctantly gave it up when I went back to work because my daughter just wouldn’t do the work of nursing when she was used to bottles, but anyway, because nursing was hard work, it took a major committment on my part to keep doing it. If I had paid any heed to all those people who were so freaking crazy about “privacy” I never would have been able to keep going. We had friends who would come over and the woman who has 2 children she nursed - one she had only just weaned had a fit because I didn’t want to go in the other room to nurse because her husband was there. He didn’t care, I didn’t care, my husband didn’t care, but SHE cared and so I was banished for an hour while my daughter nursed and unable to enjoy adult company because the thought of her husband being in the same room with a woman who was nursing and wasn’t her was too distressful for her. If she wasn’t so important to my husband I would have told her to fuck off, but I digress.
Anyway, we say, “breast is best” but then you have all these idiots saying I guess that means you should never be in public. Idiots all of them.