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	<title>Comments on: Duke Case: Will Mary Doe&#8217;s Past Rape Report Be Admissible In Court?</title>
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	<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/</link>
	<description>Feminist, anti-racist, pro-fat, plus whatever else we feel like talking about.</description>
	<pubDate>Sat, 22 Nov 2008 12:52:12 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: mike green</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-140556</link>
		<dc:creator>mike green</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Jun 2006 18:01:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-140556</guid>
		<description>I think the only way that the accuser's past claim of rape 10 years would be allowed under the rape sheild law woild be if there were substantial evidence that it was false. That would go not to her sexual behavior, but her truthfullness with respect to rape claims, and a propensity tp fabricate claims. The mere fact she choose not to pursue these claims, as many rape victims do, would not reach such a standard. So there is no reason to believe that such evidence of the past accusation could or should be admissible at trail. Barring real evidence the allegations were false, this is not even a close call.

As to her own belated admissions ( she initially claimed that she had not had sex within a week prior to the Duke party) that she had sex with three men and had used vibrators in a sexual manner on the evening of the alleged attack prior to the arriving at the  party, these would be relevent and admissible both as to the possible origin of the general swelling in her genital area as well as to her truthfulness, since she gave an inconsistant story on this issue in a previous account.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the only way that the accuser&#8217;s past claim of rape 10 years would be allowed under the rape sheild law woild be if there were substantial evidence that it was false. That would go not to her sexual behavior, but her truthfullness with respect to rape claims, and a propensity tp fabricate claims. The mere fact she choose not to pursue these claims, as many rape victims do, would not reach such a standard. So there is no reason to believe that such evidence of the past accusation could or should be admissible at trail. Barring real evidence the allegations were false, this is not even a close call.</p>
<p>As to her own belated admissions ( she initially claimed that she had not had sex within a week prior to the Duke party) that she had sex with three men and had used vibrators in a sexual manner on the evening of the alleged attack prior to the arriving at the  party, these would be relevent and admissible both as to the possible origin of the general swelling in her genital area as well as to her truthfulness, since she gave an inconsistant story on this issue in a previous account.</p>
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		<title>By: mythago</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110539</link>
		<dc:creator>mythago</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Apr 2006 19:34:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110539</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;I don't think North Carolina has a statute of limitations for statutory rape.&lt;/i&gt;

There isn't as of 1998. The reported rape happened in 1993, before the statute of limitations changed (as far as I can tell) and at any rate, the men named in the report saying "I didn't do it" would not prove that the earlier report was false. (And anyway, where would they testify? In the rape trial of the Duke lacrosse team members? In a perjury hearing? In a new rape case when the accuser declined to prosecute last century?)

The defense will probably appeal if there were a conviction, on all kinds of grounds.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>I don&#8217;t think North Carolina has a statute of limitations for statutory rape.</i></p>
<p>There isn&#8217;t as of 1998. The reported rape happened in 1993, before the statute of limitations changed (as far as I can tell) and at any rate, the men named in the report saying &#8220;I didn&#8217;t do it&#8221; would not prove that the earlier report was false. (And anyway, where would they testify? In the rape trial of the Duke lacrosse team members? In a perjury hearing? In a new rape case when the accuser declined to prosecute last century?)</p>
<p>The defense will probably appeal if there were a conviction, on all kinds of grounds.</p>
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		<title>By: Maia</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110505</link>
		<dc:creator>Maia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Apr 2006 10:40:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110505</guid>
		<description>One of the things that made me most angry in hte police rape trial that was held in New Zealand recently was the double standard about what was admissable as evidence.

The fact that the complainant had been part of trial that had returned a not guilty verdict before (after 2 mistrials because police officers had 'accidentally' entered non-admissable evidence during testimony) was considered evidence.

The legal history of the defendents was not.

Apparently, New Zealand rape laws were changed in 1993, and those changes were completely ground breaking, and included a bunch of feminist ideas.   Unfortunately it doesn't seem to have done much good.   Which isn't that surprising, given that the system is still run by and for the men in power.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One of the things that made me most angry in hte police rape trial that was held in New Zealand recently was the double standard about what was admissable as evidence.</p>
<p>The fact that the complainant had been part of trial that had returned a not guilty verdict before (after 2 mistrials because police officers had &#8216;accidentally&#8217; entered non-admissable evidence during testimony) was considered evidence.</p>
<p>The legal history of the defendents was not.</p>
<p>Apparently, New Zealand rape laws were changed in 1993, and those changes were completely ground breaking, and included a bunch of feminist ideas.   Unfortunately it doesn&#8217;t seem to have done much good.   Which isn&#8217;t that surprising, given that the system is still run by and for the men in power.</p>
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		<title>By: hf</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110487</link>
		<dc:creator>hf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Apr 2006 06:31:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110487</guid>
		<description>Um, would a prior rape count as "sexual activity of the complainant"? If the defense were paying me, I'd certainly argue otherwise.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Um, would a prior rape count as &#8220;sexual activity of the complainant&#8221;? If the defense were paying me, I&#8217;d certainly argue otherwise.</p>
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		<title>By: mousehounde</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110462</link>
		<dc:creator>mousehounde</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Apr 2006 02:01:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110462</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;How much will this matter, if this case gets to trial? It depends. The prosecutor has said that the jury will never hear about it, because of South Carolina's rape shield laws.&lt;/i&gt;

Did you mean North Carolina?

&lt;em&gt;[Whoops! Thanks for catching that. Correction made. --Amp]&lt;/em&gt;

And it seems to me that doesn't matter if  Mary Doe's 1996 rape report is true or false. The only thing potential jury members will remember about it is that she has made rape accusations before. Folks will assume that because the previous report was not followed up on, it was false. And if they think that one is false, they will assume this one is false.

It breaks my heart to read about rape trials in the news. It is the only crime I know of where the victim is viewed as some kind of criminal no matter what they do.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>How much will this matter, if this case gets to trial? It depends. The prosecutor has said that the jury will never hear about it, because of South Carolina&#8217;s rape shield laws.</i></p>
<p>Did you mean North Carolina?</p>
<p><em>[Whoops! Thanks for catching that. Correction made. --Amp]</em></p>
<p>And it seems to me that doesn&#8217;t matter if  Mary Doe&#8217;s 1996 rape report is true or false. The only thing potential jury members will remember about it is that she has made rape accusations before. Folks will assume that because the previous report was not followed up on, it was false. And if they think that one is false, they will assume this one is false.</p>
<p>It breaks my heart to read about rape trials in the news. It is the only crime I know of where the victim is viewed as some kind of criminal no matter what they do.</p>
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		<title>By: Rachel S</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110455</link>
		<dc:creator>Rachel S</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Apr 2006 00:50:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110455</guid>
		<description>Alley rat's point is very important.  The two cases are quite dissimilar.  In the first case the rape was reported 3-4 years after the incident, at the urging of Mary Doe's husband.  He has stated that he thought it would help her heal.....It should also be noted that the first rape was reported in the court documents as a "statutory rape."  Her boyfriend was 7 years her senior--a 21 year old with a 14 year old.

I'm not at all surprised that there was no investiagtion given the fact that the incident was reported much later.  I also read somewhere that the police felt there was no evidence to investigate.  That could be wrong, but I think this is indicative of how these kinds of cases are treated by many in law in law enforcement.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Alley rat&#8217;s point is very important.  The two cases are quite dissimilar.  In the first case the rape was reported 3-4 years after the incident, at the urging of Mary Doe&#8217;s husband.  He has stated that he thought it would help her heal&#8230;..It should also be noted that the first rape was reported in the court documents as a &#8220;statutory rape.&#8221;  Her boyfriend was 7 years her senior&#8211;a 21 year old with a 14 year old.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not at all surprised that there was no investiagtion given the fact that the incident was reported much later.  I also read somewhere that the police felt there was no evidence to investigate.  That could be wrong, but I think this is indicative of how these kinds of cases are treated by many in law in law enforcement.</p>
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		<title>By: me</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110441</link>
		<dc:creator>me</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Apr 2006 23:29:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110441</guid>
		<description>I don't think North Carolina has a statute of limitations for statutory rape. If they don't, then this new set of men are fair game, as well they should be. However if NC does have a statute of limitations for rape, then those men can testify they did not do it and the Duke defense has their 'evidence' that her accusation was 'false'. 

Either way, charged with rape or free because of the time passed, this previous set of men will not freely admit guilt. If this accusation is ruled inadmissible, you can bet the defense will appeal this as high as they must.

Supporters of the victim must realize this and prepare now for a very long and trying journey.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t think North Carolina has a statute of limitations for statutory rape. If they don&#8217;t, then this new set of men are fair game, as well they should be. However if NC does have a statute of limitations for rape, then those men can testify they did not do it and the Duke defense has their &#8216;evidence&#8217; that her accusation was &#8216;false&#8217;. </p>
<p>Either way, charged with rape or free because of the time passed, this previous set of men will not freely admit guilt. If this accusation is ruled inadmissible, you can bet the defense will appeal this as high as they must.</p>
<p>Supporters of the victim must realize this and prepare now for a very long and trying journey.</p>
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		<title>By: alley rat</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110436</link>
		<dc:creator>alley rat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Apr 2006 22:40:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110436</guid>
		<description>Over at Justice 4 Two Sisters, there's a &lt;a href="http://www.newsobserver.com/1185/story/434044.html" rel="nofollow"&gt;link &lt;/a&gt;to a story about the previous incident. That story says the woman was 14 and was set up by her abusive adult boyfriend, who "let his friends take turns".   It also says she reported it three years later because her new boyfriend/husband encouraged her to do so, to help her heal.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Over at Justice 4 Two Sisters, there&#8217;s a <a href="http://www.newsobserver.com/1185/story/434044.html" rel="nofollow">link </a>to a story about the previous incident. That story says the woman was 14 and was set up by her abusive adult boyfriend, who &#8220;let his friends take turns&#8221;.   It also says she reported it three years later because her new boyfriend/husband encouraged her to do so, to help her heal.</p>
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		<title>By: Lauren</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110435</link>
		<dc:creator>Lauren</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Apr 2006 22:25:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110435</guid>
		<description>In my state the statute of limitations is five years on a warrant and ten on an alleged crime.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In my state the statute of limitations is five years on a warrant and ten on an alleged crime.</p>
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		<title>By: mythago</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110430</link>
		<dc:creator>mythago</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Apr 2006 21:24:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110430</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;the police should open this previous case and charge those men as well if that first allegation is true&lt;/i&gt;

It's probably too late. The assault happened thirteen years ago, which may well put it past the statute of limitations.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>the police should open this previous case and charge those men as well if that first allegation is true</i></p>
<p>It&#8217;s probably too late. The assault happened thirteen years ago, which may well put it past the statute of limitations.</p>
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		<title>By: brynn</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110428</link>
		<dc:creator>brynn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Apr 2006 20:35:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110428</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;And being gang-raped twice in ten years is, from what I'm able to tell, a bit like being in a major car accident twice in ten years - unlucky, but not impossibly so.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Wouldn't gang-rape at 14 with the issue never legally prosecuted nor the perpetrators punished possibly be consistent with low self-esteem that might lead to risky behavior or involvement in the sex industry, thus actually increasing the danger of a subsequent assault?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>And being gang-raped twice in ten years is, from what I&#8217;m able to tell, a bit like being in a major car accident twice in ten years - unlucky, but not impossibly so.</p></blockquote>
<p>Wouldn&#8217;t gang-rape at 14 with the issue never legally prosecuted nor the perpetrators punished possibly be consistent with low self-esteem that might lead to risky behavior or involvement in the sex industry, thus actually increasing the danger of a subsequent assault?</p>
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		<title>By: me</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110417</link>
		<dc:creator>me</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Apr 2006 19:02:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110417</guid>
		<description>Belaboring the point, I admit, but I was somewhat surprised that so many attacked Essence Magazine for reporting this first allegation rather than demanding that that first case be as thoroughly investigated as the current one against the Duke men. Even if the sex had been 'consensual', she was 14 at the time and could not by law consent if the man was indeed an adult at the time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Belaboring the point, I admit, but I was somewhat surprised that so many attacked Essence Magazine for reporting this first allegation rather than demanding that that first case be as thoroughly investigated as the current one against the Duke men. Even if the sex had been &#8216;consensual&#8217;, she was 14 at the time and could not by law consent if the man was indeed an adult at the time.</p>
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		<title>By: me</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110416</link>
		<dc:creator>me</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Apr 2006 18:50:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110416</guid>
		<description>"But here's the rub: Is there any evidence at all that Mary Doe's 1996 rape report was false? Not that I can see."

As I wrote on RachelsTavern, the police should open this previous case and charge those men as well if that first allegation is true.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;But here&#8217;s the rub: Is there any evidence at all that Mary Doe&#8217;s 1996 rape report was false? Not that I can see.&#8221;</p>
<p>As I wrote on RachelsTavern, the police should open this previous case and charge those men as well if that first allegation is true.</p>
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		<title>By: alsis39.75</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110413</link>
		<dc:creator>alsis39.75</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Apr 2006 18:14:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-110413</guid>
		<description>I've already read in a couple of places that the prior rape allegations "prove that Mary D. has some kind of bizarre fantasy about group sex blah blah blah..."

Freakin' Yahweh on a pogo stick... I need aspirin. &#62;:</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve already read in a couple of places that the prior rape allegations &#8220;prove that Mary D. has some kind of bizarre fantasy about group sex blah blah blah&#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p>Freakin&#8217; Yahweh on a pogo stick&#8230; I need aspirin. &gt;:</p>
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		<title>By: feminist blogs</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-276211</link>
		<dc:creator>feminist blogs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Jan 1970 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-276211</guid>
		<description>&lt;!--%kramer-pre%--&gt;who reported being raped by three Duke lacrosse players) reported being raped by three acquaintances (one of who may have been a boyfriend or an ex-boyfriend) to police. Although the report was made when Mary Doe was 18, she said the rape […]Continue reading at Alas, a blog … posted 2:00 pm at Alas, a blog&lt;!--%kramer-post%--&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!--%kramer-pre%-->who reported being raped by three Duke lacrosse players) reported being raped by three acquaintances (one of who may have been a boyfriend or an ex-boyfriend) to police. Although the report was made when Mary Doe was 18, she said the rape […]Continue reading at Alas, a blog … posted 2:00 pm at Alas, a blog<!--%kramer-post%--></p>
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		<title>By: FeministBlogosphere</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-276212</link>
		<dc:creator>FeministBlogosphere</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Jan 1970 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-276212</guid>
		<description>&lt;!--%kramer-pre%--&gt;04/29Duke Case: Will Mary Doe’s Past Rape Report Be Admissible In Court?&lt;!--%kramer-post%--&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!--%kramer-pre%-->04/29Duke Case: Will Mary Doe’s Past Rape Report Be Admissible In Court?<!--%kramer-post%--></p>
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		<title>By: Defense attorney</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-276210</link>
		<dc:creator>Defense attorney</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Jan 1970 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;!--%kramer-pre%--&gt; Original post:Duke Case: Will Mary Doe’s Past Rape Report Be Admissible In Court? by at Google Blog Search: defense attorney&lt;!--%kramer-post%--&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!--%kramer-pre%--> Original post:Duke Case: Will Mary Doe’s Past Rape Report Be Admissible In Court? by at Google Blog Search: defense attorney<!--%kramer-post%--></p>
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		<title>By: Alabama lawyer mesothelioma pleural</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/04/29/duke-case-will-mary-does-past-rape-report-be-admissible-in-court/#comment-276209</link>
		<dc:creator>Alabama lawyer mesothelioma pleural</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Jan 1970 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
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