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	<title>Comments on: Rape Trials Are Gender Performances</title>
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	<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/</link>
	<description>Feminist, anti-racist, pro-fat, plus whatever else we feel like talking about.</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jan 2009 23:18:33 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: sailorman</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-224929</link>
		<dc:creator>sailorman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Jan 2007 21:35:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-224929</guid>
		<description>Grey, you're not really correct.  The length of punishment for the &lt;i&gt;accused&lt;/i&gt; doesn't necessarily have a great effect on the motivation of the &lt;i&gt;&lt;/i&gt;

&lt;i&gt;[The rest of SM's comment was lost; I have no idea what happened. Sorry, Sailorman - maybe you could repost it? --Amp]&lt;/i&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Grey, you&#8217;re not really correct.  The length of punishment for the <i>accused</i> doesn&#8217;t necessarily have a great effect on the motivation of the <i></i></p>
<p><i>[The rest of SM's comment was lost; I have no idea what happened. Sorry, Sailorman - maybe you could repost it? --Amp]</i></p>
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		<title>By: Abyss2hope</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-224338</link>
		<dc:creator>Abyss2hope</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Jan 2007 16:13:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-224338</guid>
		<description>Grey, I don't buy into the myths about the number of false rape claims. Even if I did, using false claims to justify lesser or greater punishments still makes no sense. Advocating for the death penalty to reduce the number of false claims would increase the injustice to innocent men who look like the real rapists in those cases or who left DNA through consensual sex before a girl or woman was raped and murdered.

The length of the sentence should be linked to the severity of the crime and the danger the criminal poses to the public upon release.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Grey, I don&#8217;t buy into the myths about the number of false rape claims. Even if I did, using false claims to justify lesser or greater punishments still makes no sense. Advocating for the death penalty to reduce the number of false claims would increase the injustice to innocent men who look like the real rapists in those cases or who left DNA through consensual sex before a girl or woman was raped and murdered.</p>
<p>The length of the sentence should be linked to the severity of the crime and the danger the criminal poses to the public upon release.</p>
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		<title>By: Grey</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-224058</link>
		<dc:creator>Grey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Jan 2007 21:49:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-224058</guid>
		<description>lighter punishments more often applied will also lead to more false claims.

If it was a year sentence and had a 90% conviction rate, many women would not balk at accusing somene they merely hated, someone who cheated on them, or to get out of some sort of shame when caught.

If it was execution, many of those same false accusers wouldn't have the heart to do it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>lighter punishments more often applied will also lead to more false claims.</p>
<p>If it was a year sentence and had a 90% conviction rate, many women would not balk at accusing somene they merely hated, someone who cheated on them, or to get out of some sort of shame when caught.</p>
<p>If it was execution, many of those same false accusers wouldn&#8217;t have the heart to do it.</p>
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		<title>By: Mickle</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-189467</link>
		<dc:creator>Mickle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 Sep 2006 08:00:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-189467</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Another issue that impacts rape trials is that most if not all people who have been rape victims or know someone very well who was a rape victim will not be selected to sit on the jury of a rape trial.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Seriously?  I guess I shouldn't be all that surprised, but I kinda doubt they require that jurists have never been the victims of theft in a robbery trial, etc.  It makes me wonder where they draw the line in terms of how different crimes are treated and if anyone has ever bothered to apply probablity to the equation.  As in: this percentage of people will be victims of this kind of crime in their lifetime, so statisticly we'll have (blank) out of (blank) potential jurorists who have been victims of this type of crime, so, for practical reasons, we will not allow challenges/only allow certain challenges/allow all challenges based on the potential juror having been a victim of this crime.  But then, I from what I hear, the jury selection process is all screwy anyway.

One more thought: do they require potential jurists to answer the rape question in the courtroom, under oath, in front of other people?  Or is part of a questionaire? 'Cause the first would be seriously messed up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Another issue that impacts rape trials is that most if not all people who have been rape victims or know someone very well who was a rape victim will not be selected to sit on the jury of a rape trial.</p></blockquote>
<p>Seriously?  I guess I shouldn&#8217;t be all that surprised, but I kinda doubt they require that jurists have never been the victims of theft in a robbery trial, etc.  It makes me wonder where they draw the line in terms of how different crimes are treated and if anyone has ever bothered to apply probablity to the equation.  As in: this percentage of people will be victims of this kind of crime in their lifetime, so statisticly we&#8217;ll have (blank) out of (blank) potential jurorists who have been victims of this type of crime, so, for practical reasons, we will not allow challenges/only allow certain challenges/allow all challenges based on the potential juror having been a victim of this crime.  But then, I from what I hear, the jury selection process is all screwy anyway.</p>
<p>One more thought: do they require potential jurists to answer the rape question in the courtroom, under oath, in front of other people?  Or is part of a questionaire? &#8216;Cause the first would be seriously messed up.</p>
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		<title>By: Alas, a blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Beyond A Reasonable Doubt, The Rape/Consent Spectrum, And Restorative Justice</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-189323</link>
		<dc:creator>Alas, a blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Beyond A Reasonable Doubt, The Rape/Consent Spectrum, And Restorative Justice</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Sep 2006 14:12:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-189323</guid>
		<description>[...] &#171; Rape Trials Are Gender Performances  Home [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] &laquo; Rape Trials Are Gender Performances  Home [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Beyond A Reasonable Doubt, The Rape/Consent Spectrum, And Restorative Justice &#171; Creative Destruction</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-189322</link>
		<dc:creator>Beyond A Reasonable Doubt, The Rape/Consent Spectrum, And Restorative Justice &#171; Creative Destruction</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Sep 2006 14:11:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-189322</guid>
		<description>[...] In my previous post, I argued that feminist reforms to the text of rape laws won&#8217;t, by themselves, lead to large differences in how rape is treated by the justice system. This is because the people who make the justice system happen will resist changes they believe are wrong. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] In my previous post, I argued that feminist reforms to the text of rape laws won&#8217;t, by themselves, lead to large differences in how rape is treated by the justice system. This is because the people who make the justice system happen will resist changes they believe are wrong. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Polymath</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-189305</link>
		<dc:creator>Polymath</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Sep 2006 12:37:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-189305</guid>
		<description>nice post.

the conservative call for harsher punishments  is a typical version of their illusion that merely having fair laws is enough for to create social justice.  when my (one) very conservative friend suggested that affirmative action would be unnecessary if there were simply laws against discrimination, he thought that a minority victim of discrimination could simply bring charges, as if the criminal justice system is fair to minorities.  Black people have been given no reason to trust the courts as a practical solution to everyday racism (even conservatives probably agree with that, to some extent).  and thus it should be no surprise that women can't trust the courts as a practical solution to sexism, including its most extreme and violent forms.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>nice post.</p>
<p>the conservative call for harsher punishments  is a typical version of their illusion that merely having fair laws is enough for to create social justice.  when my (one) very conservative friend suggested that affirmative action would be unnecessary if there were simply laws against discrimination, he thought that a minority victim of discrimination could simply bring charges, as if the criminal justice system is fair to minorities.  Black people have been given no reason to trust the courts as a practical solution to everyday racism (even conservatives probably agree with that, to some extent).  and thus it should be no surprise that women can&#8217;t trust the courts as a practical solution to sexism, including its most extreme and violent forms.</p>
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		<title>By: Abyss2hope</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-189259</link>
		<dc:creator>Abyss2hope</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Sep 2006 05:17:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-189259</guid>
		<description>Another issue that impacts rape trials is that most if not all people who have been rape victims or know someone very well who was a rape victim will not be selected to sit on the jury of a rape trial. That seems to slant the jury toward those who get most of their understanding of what rape is and isn't from TV dramas and other fiction.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Another issue that impacts rape trials is that most if not all people who have been rape victims or know someone very well who was a rape victim will not be selected to sit on the jury of a rape trial. That seems to slant the jury toward those who get most of their understanding of what rape is and isn&#8217;t from TV dramas and other fiction.</p>
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		<title>By: the oh zone &#187; //Heather B//Link round-up from the feminist blogs: a blog that hurts</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-189200</link>
		<dc:creator>the oh zone &#187; //Heather B//Link round-up from the feminist blogs: a blog that hurts</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Sep 2006 21:14:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-189200</guid>
		<description>[...] Over at Alas, a blog, Ampersand has a post up discussing a recent article in the Columbia Journal of Gender and Law on &#8216;gender performance&#8217; in rape trials. Because of media saturation in terms of depictions of &#8216;rapists&#8217; and &#8216;victims&#8217;, the way an accuser presents during the trial (especially her testimony) can powerfully affect the attitudes of the jury towards the accuser and the defendant. Ampersand makes the point that reforming rape laws to better protect accusers, while a necessary feminist goal, is not enough in and of itself: [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Over at Alas, a blog, Ampersand has a post up discussing a recent article in the Columbia Journal of Gender and Law on &#8216;gender performance&#8217; in rape trials. Because of media saturation in terms of depictions of &#8216;rapists&#8217; and &#8216;victims&#8217;, the way an accuser presents during the trial (especially her testimony) can powerfully affect the attitudes of the jury towards the accuser and the defendant. Ampersand makes the point that reforming rape laws to better protect accusers, while a necessary feminist goal, is not enough in and of itself: [...]</p>
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		<title>By: QrazyQat</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-189175</link>
		<dc:creator>QrazyQat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Sep 2006 18:45:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-189175</guid>
		<description>The attitudes of the people are what Peggy Sanday feels is the reason that the matrilineal (and Islamic) Minagkabau in Sumatra have a virtually rape-free culture.  It's not a draconian response that's needed so much as a sure response.

That is, if you are a inclined to rape and see a system that has severe penalties for rape which aren't applied evenly, or all that often, and you feel that you hae a good chance of getting away with it even if you're caught, you are more likely to rape.  If, OTOH, you have a system where you are extremely highly likely to be punished you are less likely even if the punishment is not potentially as severe.  (This also tends to create a system where rape is more likely to be found out than in a system where the victim often suffers more shame than rage.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The attitudes of the people are what Peggy Sanday feels is the reason that the matrilineal (and Islamic) Minagkabau in Sumatra have a virtually rape-free culture.  It&#8217;s not a draconian response that&#8217;s needed so much as a sure response.</p>
<p>That is, if you are a inclined to rape and see a system that has severe penalties for rape which aren&#8217;t applied evenly, or all that often, and you feel that you hae a good chance of getting away with it even if you&#8217;re caught, you are more likely to rape.  If, OTOH, you have a system where you are extremely highly likely to be punished you are less likely even if the punishment is not potentially as severe.  (This also tends to create a system where rape is more likely to be found out than in a system where the victim often suffers more shame than rage.)</p>
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		<title>By: phantasmagorias.net</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-262849</link>
		<dc:creator>phantasmagorias.net</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Jan 1970 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-262849</guid>
		<description>&lt;!--%kramer-pre%--&gt; almost anything.  On the politics and feminism front: more on the “Public Expression of Religion Act”; a list of class, etc. privileges; looks like “hysteria” is making a comeback; rape trials as gender performances, followed by this equally excellent post on the subject; a retort for all those “I’m not a feminist but…”; a post on the sickening trend of rape pr0n spam; thoughts on the detainee bill passed (and I can&lt;!--%kramer-post%--&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!--%kramer-pre%--> almost anything.  On the politics and feminism front: more on the “Public Expression of Religion Act”; a list of class, etc. privileges; looks like “hysteria” is making a comeback; rape trials as gender performances, followed by this equally excellent post on the subject; a retort for all those “I’m not a feminist but…”; a post on the sickening trend of rape pr0n spam; thoughts on the detainee bill passed (and I can<!--%kramer-post%--></p>
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		<title>By: feminist blogs</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-262850</link>
		<dc:creator>feminist blogs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Jan 1970 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-262850</guid>
		<description>&lt;!--%kramer-pre%--&gt;   In my previous post, I argued that feminist reforms to the text of rape laws won’t, by themselves, lead to large differences in how rape is treated by the justice system. This is because the people who make the justice system happen will resist changes they believe are&lt;!--%kramer-post%--&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!--%kramer-pre%-->   In my previous post, I argued that feminist reforms to the text of rape laws won’t, by themselves, lead to large differences in how rape is treated by the justice system. This is because the people who make the justice system happen will resist changes they believe are<!--%kramer-post%--></p>
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		<title>By: Pacific Views</title>
		<link>http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-262851</link>
		<dc:creator>Pacific Views</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Jan 1970 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2006/09/28/rape-trials-are-gender-performances/#comment-262851</guid>
		<description>&lt;!--%kramer-pre%--&gt;yet another E. European who sees America becoming a dictatorship, a claim bolstered by the adjacent link to Alberto Gonzales threatening judges for going against the administration.  Ampersand explains why rape trials are more about gender performance than law and also complains that even if Hugo Chavez isn't anti-Semitic, he embraces woman-hating Iran.   In response to that last, I'll point again to this article about college enrollment and professional careers for Iranian women&lt;!--%kramer-post%--&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!--%kramer-pre%-->yet another E. European who sees America becoming a dictatorship, a claim bolstered by the adjacent link to Alberto Gonzales threatening judges for going against the administration.  Ampersand explains why rape trials are more about gender performance than law and also complains that even if Hugo Chavez isn&#8217;t anti-Semitic, he embraces woman-hating Iran.   In response to that last, I&#8217;ll point again to this article about college enrollment and professional careers for Iranian women<!--%kramer-post%--></p>
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