Comments on: The Soldier’s Truce Of 1914 http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2007/12/25/the-soldiers-truce-of-1914/ Feminist, anti-racist, pro-fat, plus whatever else we feel like talking about. Sat, 30 Aug 2008 03:02:58 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.3.1 By: Dianne http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2007/12/25/the-soldiers-truce-of-1914/#comment-314094 Dianne Thu, 27 Dec 2007 19:41:46 +0000 http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2007/12/25/the-soldiers-truce-of-1914/#comment-314094 <i>I think you’ve got the direction of invasion inverted, Dianne. ;)</i> Nah. Neither country in my example (Britain and Germany) got invaded but both feared invasion to some extent. If I'd mentioned France that would be different... I think you’ve got the direction of invasion inverted, Dianne. ;)

Nah. Neither country in my example (Britain and Germany) got invaded but both feared invasion to some extent. If I’d mentioned France that would be different…

]]> By: Robert http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2007/12/25/the-soldiers-truce-of-1914/#comment-314079 Robert Thu, 27 Dec 2007 17:25:48 +0000 http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2007/12/25/the-soldiers-truce-of-1914/#comment-314079 I think you've got the direction of invasion inverted, Dianne. ;) I think you’ve got the direction of invasion inverted, Dianne. ;)

]]> By: Dianne http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2007/12/25/the-soldiers-truce-of-1914/#comment-314074 Dianne Thu, 27 Dec 2007 16:46:11 +0000 http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2007/12/25/the-soldiers-truce-of-1914/#comment-314074 WWI must have been a very strange experience regardless. In the early 20th century, Europe was pretty interconnected so it must have felt almost like a civil war. You might well have celebrated Christmas 1913 with the same people that you were now shooting at. One example: In Handschusheim, there is a park with an 18th century manor house (now housing Stadtverwaltung) on its edge. It is known as Graham Park after the people who built the house: an english family that summered in Handschuhsheim up until 1914. The house wasn't actually confiscated by the city until 1916. I'm not sure why: finally gave up on the war ending quickly? 2 years arrears on property taxes? It must have been very disturbing to see the people who used to come in a friendly manner and spend the summer suddenly trying to invade. WWI must have been a very strange experience regardless. In the early 20th century, Europe was pretty interconnected so it must have felt almost like a civil war. You might well have celebrated Christmas 1913 with the same people that you were now shooting at. One example: In Handschusheim, there is a park with an 18th century manor house (now housing Stadtverwaltung) on its edge. It is known as Graham Park after the people who built the house: an english family that summered in Handschuhsheim up until 1914. The house wasn’t actually confiscated by the city until 1916. I’m not sure why: finally gave up on the war ending quickly? 2 years arrears on property taxes? It must have been very disturbing to see the people who used to come in a friendly manner and spend the summer suddenly trying to invade.

]]> By: Rad Geek http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2007/12/25/the-soldiers-truce-of-1914/#comment-314001 Rad Geek Wed, 26 Dec 2007 08:49:05 +0000 http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2007/12/25/the-soldiers-truce-of-1914/#comment-314001 Robert, One shouldn't ignore the effects that conscription had, and the shifts in consensus within the military where it has been abolished. But in a line of work where your boss has the legal power to treat striking or quitting as a hanging crime, the line between volunteers and conscripts is fuzzier than it might at first appear. That mattered a lot for the boys who signed up voluntarily in the Great War, not knowing what they would find in the trenches. And it matters a lot today in this age of stop-loss and endless reserve call-ups. Robert,

One shouldn’t ignore the effects that conscription had, and the shifts in consensus within the military where it has been abolished. But in a line of work where your boss has the legal power to treat striking or quitting as a hanging crime, the line between volunteers and conscripts is fuzzier than it might at first appear.

That mattered a lot for the boys who signed up voluntarily in the Great War, not knowing what they would find in the trenches. And it matters a lot today in this age of stop-loss and endless reserve call-ups.

]]> By: Tom Nolan http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2007/12/25/the-soldiers-truce-of-1914/#comment-313964 Tom Nolan Tue, 25 Dec 2007 11:52:22 +0000 http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2007/12/25/the-soldiers-truce-of-1914/#comment-313964 As I recall, Robert, the British Army, at least, was a volunteer army in the first year of WWI, not a conscript army. As I recall, Robert, the British Army, at least, was a volunteer army in the first year of WWI, not a conscript army.

]]> By: Robert http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2007/12/25/the-soldiers-truce-of-1914/#comment-313955 Robert Tue, 25 Dec 2007 07:25:49 +0000 http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2007/12/25/the-soldiers-truce-of-1914/#comment-313955 <i>Or, to put it another way, who could possibly make a more effective anti-war activist than a soldier, on the battlefield, given an actual choice between fighting and peace?</i> Well, maybe. For those countries still using conscript troops, this could be a potential tactic, I guess - although states that are willing to use conscript troops are also largely immune to civil disobedience predicated on a state's unwillingness to kill its own people in large numbers. As the WWI truce makes clear, once the brass starts shooting people, the people fall back into line and go back to the war. But conscript troops are a dead-end, which is why none of the world's premier militaries use them. (I guess Israel could be said to have conscription, but universal service isn't psychologically or morally the same as ooh-shit-a-war-quick-draft-an-army - the IDF is a professional force of people who want to be there, not draftees a la WWI.) To have a good military, you have to have volunteer professional soldiers. Very few people become professional soldiers so that they can live out their anti-war dreams. Soldiers are very often "anti-war" in the specific sense of not wanting to get shot, and in the sense of wanting to have a decent cause to fight for. But they signed up knowing that fighting was the reason for the existence of their job. The WWI soldiers had truces and such because they didn't want to be there. Today's professional soldiers do want to be there, kind of. Or, to put it another way, who could possibly make a more effective anti-war activist than a soldier, on the battlefield, given an actual choice between fighting and peace?

Well, maybe. For those countries still using conscript troops, this could be a potential tactic, I guess - although states that are willing to use conscript troops are also largely immune to civil disobedience predicated on a state’s unwillingness to kill its own people in large numbers. As the WWI truce makes clear, once the brass starts shooting people, the people fall back into line and go back to the war.

But conscript troops are a dead-end, which is why none of the world’s premier militaries use them. (I guess Israel could be said to have conscription, but universal service isn’t psychologically or morally the same as ooh-shit-a-war-quick-draft-an-army - the IDF is a professional force of people who want to be there, not draftees a la WWI.) To have a good military, you have to have volunteer professional soldiers.

Very few people become professional soldiers so that they can live out their anti-war dreams. Soldiers are very often “anti-war” in the specific sense of not wanting to get shot, and in the sense of wanting to have a decent cause to fight for. But they signed up knowing that fighting was the reason for the existence of their job.

The WWI soldiers had truces and such because they didn’t want to be there. Today’s professional soldiers do want to be there, kind of.

]]> By: David Simon http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2007/12/25/the-soldiers-truce-of-1914/#comment-313953 David Simon Tue, 25 Dec 2007 05:57:38 +0000 http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2007/12/25/the-soldiers-truce-of-1914/#comment-313953 NotACookie, it could also be tragic to <i>understate</i> its potential importance. War changes all the time, just like nearly every other aspect of human society. Maybe an "exploit" like this could prevent bloodshed on a larger scale. Or, to put it another way, who could possibly make a more effective anti-war activist than a soldier, on the battlefield, given an actual choice between fighting and peace? NotACookie, it could also be tragic to understate its potential importance. War changes all the time, just like nearly every other aspect of human society. Maybe an “exploit” like this could prevent bloodshed on a larger scale. Or, to put it another way, who could possibly make a more effective anti-war activist than a soldier, on the battlefield, given an actual choice between fighting and peace?

]]> By: NotACookie http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2007/12/25/the-soldiers-truce-of-1914/#comment-313948 NotACookie Tue, 25 Dec 2007 03:36:44 +0000 http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2007/12/25/the-soldiers-truce-of-1914/#comment-313948 One observation -- temporary front-line truces were routine in pre-WWI military history. Rather than a unique moment of shared humanity, this was the last gasp of a long tradition of professional courtesy between solders. Off the top of my head, there are cases of front-line truces in the Peninsular War and in the US Civil War. And, of course, the shooting resumed the next day. It's an interesting, and perhaps even a moving story, but we ought not overstate its importance. One observation — temporary front-line truces were routine in pre-WWI military history. Rather than a unique moment of shared humanity, this was the last gasp of a long tradition of professional courtesy between solders. Off the top of my head, there are cases of front-line truces in the Peninsular War and in the US Civil War.

And, of course, the shooting resumed the next day.

It’s an interesting, and perhaps even a moving story, but we ought not overstate its importance.

]]> By: Cilla, AKA Big Noise http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2007/12/25/the-soldiers-truce-of-1914/#comment-313940 Cilla, AKA Big Noise Tue, 25 Dec 2007 01:14:36 +0000 http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2007/12/25/the-soldiers-truce-of-1914/#comment-313940 After reading this review, I called my husband in from the other room and he read it. We sat for a while and could only say, "WOW!" Thanks for sharing this awesome book and its review with us. I am heading to a bookseller now to buy it. Happy Holidays After reading this review, I called my husband in from the other room and he read it. We sat for a while and could only say, “WOW!” Thanks for sharing this awesome book and its review with us. I am heading to a bookseller now to buy it.
Happy Holidays

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